The Outdoor Line Forum

USFS Won’t Issue Baker Lake Fishing Guide Permits
(From Northwest Sportsman Magazine on line) http://nwsportsmanmag.wordpress.com/2011/05/31/usfs-wont-issue-baker-lake-fishing-guide-permits/


Bad news for fishing guides hoping to run trips on Baker Lake for sockeye this summer: The Mount Baker-Snoqualmie National Forest’s district ranger says he will not issue commercial permits for the 3,100-acre reservoir in Washington’s North Cascades.

Several guides have expressed interest in taking clients out to hook into the red salmon which run 4 to 6 pounds, with a few bigger than that.

While state managers must wait another month and a half or so for the sockeye to actually return to the Baker River to determine if enough are available to even hold a season in the lake, the Washington Department of Fish & Wildlife biologist for the watershed says it’s “pretty likely” there will be.

“We’ve had a lot more smolts going out and that really helps the odds right there – having the juveniles in the first place,” says district bio Brett Barkdull in LaConner.

During last summer’s first season ever, several thousand were caught by anglers using tactics similar to those used on Lakes Washington and Wenatchee.

It’s also likely there will be more fisheries in the future thanks to salmon-friendly enhancements to the system by Puget Sound Energy, which operates two dams on the Baker River.

But because Baker Lake is almost entirely inside the national forest, it falls under the management authority of the Forest Service, says District Ranger Jon Vanderheyden in Sedro-Woolley — same as with wild and scenic stretches of the Skagit and Sauk Rivers and other northern Cascades streams that the USFS requires commercial permits to work.

For the US Forest Service to shut out guides who have promoted this fishery and booked clients in anticipation of a season is ridiculous We'll be asking some pointed questions of the Ranger who made this ruling.

I got the letter in the mail and couldn't believe what I was reading. What the hell?? Although I have no plans on fishing up there it blow me away they would even consider pulling some crap like that. Especially in this economy.

Does anyone know why they went this route? If they required a Forest Service permit to guide on the lake only a handful of guides would qualify. Seems like the easy way out to me. I feel bad for my bros that were counting on this.

Typical government beauracracy run wild. Some guys in an office arbitrarily make a decision that affects so many people's livelihood and enjoyment of our resources. Those resources are the publics not theirs. They will get a reminder on Saturday of who pays their salaries. These government agencies are overrun with people that have an agenda and in many cases overstaffed with people trying to justify their existense. It's a constant battle to stand up to these agencies but one we have to continually fight. I can't wait to talk to this guy Saturday.

Robbo wrote:Does anyone know why they went this route? If they required a Forest Service permit to guide on the lake only a handful of guides would qualify. Seems like the easy way out to me. I feel bad for my bros that were counting on this.

Wouldn't the guides that already have the permit be able to fish there?

Mystical Legends wrote:

Robbo wrote:Does anyone know why they went this route? If they required a Forest Service permit to guide on the lake only a handful of guides would qualify. Seems like the easy way out to me. I feel bad for my bros that were counting on this.

Wouldn't the guides that already have the permit be able to fish there?

This is a permit specific to the sockeye fishery on Baker lake

Salmonhawk wrote:

Mystical Legends wrote:

Robbo wrote:Does anyone know why they went this route? If they required a Forest Service permit to guide on the lake only a handful of guides would qualify. Seems like the easy way out to me. I feel bad for my bros that were counting on this.

Wouldn't the guides that already have the permit be able to fish there?

This is a permit specific to the sockeye fishery on Baker lake

Interesting as one would think the Forest permit would let the holder fish through out the park. I have a hard time understanding why a couple guys in that office would be against guides working the lake? To single out one user group and the benefits to others that may have a need or at least a want for that service is not only wrong but seems like it may be illegal.

For those of you that don't already know me, my name is John Koenig, owner of John's Guide Service here in Skagit County. I've been a full time guide for close to two decades now and have guided fishing trips all over the State of Washington and Alaska before settling down in Skagit County in 1997 to learn every rock, nook and cranny of the Skagit System's Rivers and Tributaries that I've fished since I was a kid with my Grandfather... the river system and county I now call home and pretty much spend every waking moment on.
To me this letter and news is nothing less than a swift kick in the nards. This is where and how I make my living and support my wife and daughter.

For those that don't know what the exact letter we received says here you go;

"To Whom it May Concern,

This letter is to inform you that permits will NOT be issued for Commercial Outfitting and Guiding for fishing on Baker Lake, on the Mt. Baker Ranger District, during the upcoming sockeye fishery, managed by the Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife.

Commercial Outfitting and Guiding on national forests is typically offered in areas where there is a demand for such services that cannot be met through private means. In this case, there appears to be sufficient capacity among private boaters as to overwhelm our existing facilities. In addition, because the Sockeye fishery is a new development as a result of increased fish production, there is no history of permitted commercial guiding on the resevoir. The issuance of new Outfitter and Guide permits requires several steps including a needs assessment, environmental analysis and issuance of a prospectus. Such an effort would only be undertaken if the need for such services was clearly established.

We request that you respect the regulations concerning commmercial operations on National Forest lands. There will be an increased law enforcement presence on the lake throughout the season and anyone found to be conducting commercial activities is subject to being cited for their activities. These regulations will be enforced. We appreciate your understanding and cooperation.

If you have any questions please contact Jon Venderheyden, District Ranger at 360-854-2601 or Greta Movassaghi at 360-854-2630

Sincerely,
Jon Vanderheyden"

Hence... The swift kick in the nards!

This is what I got from the letter...
- "New permits will NOT be issued!" So what about the permit I still have that is still good until July 31, 2011 and says right on it, the $95.00 dollar fee I paid for it is "non-refundable"

- "Guiding on national forests is typically offered in areas where there is a demand for such services that cannot be met through private means." So all the clients that fished with me last year or want to go this year are not supplying a demand. What about the people that dont own a boat or are handicapped and the only way they can fish is with a guide? Isn't that discrimintaion?!?!

- " In this case, there appears to be sufficient capacity among private boaters as to overwhelm our existing facilities." I nor the other two previously permitted guides that I know of even used a USFS Boat Ramp... We all launched at the PSE Privately owned Boat Ramp!!

- "The issuance of new Outfitter and Guide permits requires several steps including a needs assessment, environmental analysis and issuance of a prospectus. Such an effort would only be undertaken if the need for such services was clearly established." What the heck is all that... Did they do all that for our permits last year?

- "We request that you respect the regulations concerning commmercial operations on National Forest lands. There will be an increased law enforcement presence on the lake throughout the season and anyone found to be conducting commercial activities is subject to being cited for their activities. These regulations will be enforced." Sounds like a threat to me!

Anyways,... You would think that if the USFS would want anyone on the fishery it would be veteran guides that show more sound stewardship to our natural resources and fisheries than just about anyone else... wouldn't you? Who else better to educate the rest of the population about the natural wonders and resources the land and waters have to offer than guides?

On any spot on the upper Skagit River I can point to every ridge and peek and name them all, and have been to the top of most. I can tell you the entire history of the Upper Skagit Valley and point out peices of that history sticking out from the mighty Skagit' river banks.
I challenge Mr. Jon Venderheyden, District Ranger to be able to do the same!!

Brothers Tom, Tobeck and Robbo, Give this guy a swift kick back in the nards for me will ya?!

"There's a thin red line between genius and insanity, not only have most crossed it many times... They've completely erassed it!!"
Johnny Coho

Dude! they say your existing permit is no good..did I read that right???

If it was a Fly Fish only fishery they would be all aboard. Those Forest Circus choads don't want anymore heathen gear fisherman than they already have up there.